Something more with Jack Sheffield

ROY: Hey it’s Roy Fields and you’re watching Something More! And my guest today is Jack Sheffield! He has a tremendous healing ministry and we wanna get to know him just a little bit more! That’s what this show is all about! It’s called Something More because there are some things that Sid doesn’t have the time to really cover with his guests. So it’s great to meet you, Jack!

JACK: You too!

ROY: I wanna get right into it!

JACK: Let’s go!

ROY: I wanna talk about - when did you come to Christ? Because you know, every minister and ministry that comes through here, and guests we know, that they’re in ministry. But I wanna find out the back story!

JACK: Sure!

ROY: How did you come to Christ and what were you like before that?

JACK: Well before that I was rebellious. When John Kennedy got killed -

ROY: Oh wow! Okay.

JACK: In ‘63 and then his brother got killed, Bobby, in ‘68 our generation became very angry, very disillusioned, very rebellious and that happened to me! I ended up doing drugs. I was in rock and roll music and we ended up doing a lot of drugs, a lot of self-destructive kinds of behaviors. And so I practiced Buddhism, Hinduism, you know meditation. All the things that the New Age would offer to try to find meaning!

ROY: So you’re trying anything!

JACK: Anything!

ROY: Yeah!

JACK: And everything! And it was really way out of bounds! And I did not have a lot of Christian background growing up. I was Roman Catholic but did not know about Jesus at all! My sister died at age 24 and I shook my fist to heaven and I said to God if that’s what You’re all about I don’t want anything to do with you!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: And it took about 6 years for me to plummet to the depths of where I was really demonized. I was hearing voices. I was suicidal. Very, very self-destructive and it was at that point that I realized that somebody was praying for me! And I ended up in her front yard and gave my life to Jesus Christ! When I did that - you know the Bible talks about the worm that dies not?

ROY: Yeah.

JACK: This pain, this destructive thing inside of a human being that can eat their soul? And what it really is, Roy is its guilt; its shame, its fear, its torment, its shame. You know, times of anger and bitterness! And it was a very, very dark period of my life!

ROY: And it seemed to multiply in your life -

JACK: It did!

ROY: And just take you down.

JACK: It did. And I was desperate. And -

ROY: Who’s this person though?

JACK: This person -

ROY: Who’s this person?

JACK:  Named Wanda, was praying for me! She had a blackboard and my name was number 2 on the hit list for Jesus!

ROY: [laughs]

JACK: [laughs]

ROY: Okay!

JACK: They prayed for me at every meal. They prayed for everybody that was on that blackboard! And the next thing I know I’m driving up to her nursery. She had a big nursery right outside of Houston Texas and when I walked up to her she stuck a 12-gauge finger right in my nose and said, Jack Sheffield! You’re going straight to hell!

ROY: No way!

JACK: Somebody had told her, you know? "Jack Sheffield’s going to hell!" and she said, "Not MY Jack Sheffield! My Jack Sheffield’s going to heaven! I’m not gonna let him go to hell!"

ROY: Wow!

JACK: That’s amazing!

ROY: Who was this lady though? She just - did you know her?

JACK: I did know her. I dated her daughter when I was in Junior High.

ROY: Oh wow! Okay.

JACK: And I knew that Wanda loved me and somehow -

ROY: So she watched you go through your days of -

JACK: She did.

ROY: Darkness

JACK: She did! And she had an anointing on her for winning young people to the Lord! This was during the Charismatic renewal in the church!

ROY: Okay.

JACK: And she was depressed and somewhat suicidal herself. Was taking tranquilizers in a time where if you did that you were a pariah in society. And she went to a spirit-filled downtown church in Houston, Texas where the Spirit of God was falling and she just got healed laughing! Fell on the floor in this very traditional church! Rolling around on the floor for about 20 minutes and got up totally sane!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: Poured out all of her tranquilizers on the way home!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: And God spoke to her and said you’re gonna win so many young people to the Lord!

ROY: That must have been very encouraging to you to hear somebody believe in you too! To speak into your life!

JACK: Absolutely!

ROY: So what happened to you when you came to Christ and she led you obviously -

JACK: She did.

ROY: To the Lord!
JF: She did!

ROY: Take me through that! What happened to you? Did you feel different? Did you feel - 

JACK: Yes.

ROY: Completely changed? What was that like?

JACK: Well she got me down on my knees in a ditch on Highway 98 right outside of Richmond, Texas where I grew up right by the Brazos River.

ROY: Okay.

JACK: I confessed all of my sins and when I did the golden honey, the liquid golden honey of heaven -

ROY: Hmm!
JF: Just came down! I knew none of this!

ROY: Yeah.

JACK: And this just saturated my entire being! Went all the way down my body and washed that worm right out my feet!

ROY: That’s the best way you can describe it, isn’t it?

JACK: Yeah.

ROY: Because I hear so many people say that!

JACK: Yes.

ROY: They say it’s like liquid honey just came on me!

JACK: Exactly!

ROY: Warm and just surrounding and - that’s amazing that heaven responds that way! 
JF: Exactly!

ROY: That Jesus responds that way!

JACK: And I had no categories for this. I had no idea what this was!

ROY: Huh-huh!

JACK: And I spoke in a heavenly language and had no idea what I was doing!

ROY: Oh so you were filled with the Holy Spirit immediately?

JACK: The time I was born again I was instantly filled with the Holy Spirit!

ROY: Wow! Did you speak in tongues as well?
JF: I did! I did! And then God gave us a healing ministry! I mean right out of the gate we just started seeing people getting healed! It’s one of the greatest moves of the Spirit ever! Billy Graham called it “The Jesus Generation!”

ROY: Okay.

JACK: And all of my hippie friends got saved!

ROY: Yeah, yeah! So this is in the Æ70’s obviously?

JACK: It was fabulous! It was a great time!

ROY: Yeah! The Jesus Revolution was on Time Magazine too, wasn’t it?

JACK: Exactly.

ROY: 1974 I think or something?
JF: I think so, yes.

ROY: So you just - you immediately got downloaded with a whole ministry?

JACK: Uh-huh.

ROY: And that makes sense because what you’ve been delivered from, what you’ve been forgiven the Lord says he who has been forgiven much forgives much!

JACK: Yes.

ROY: So you started having a burden for everybody around you?

JACK: Yeah.

ROY: And God’s using you today. You have, a healing center in San Antonio?

JACK: Yes, sir.

ROY: Tell me a little bit about that.

JACK: Well my wife and I started traveling the world. I was, you know, a denominational minister for years.

ROY: Uh-huh.

JACK: And then in 2001 we left the parish ministry in the Episcopal Church and started traveling all over North America and Great Britain and doing conferences and watching people get healed everywhere? We’ve been on 6 continents!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: But what happened was, we realized that only about 10% of the people were really truly being transformed and healed in our conferences. And so we read a little bit about John G. Lake and how he would take people into inner healing kinds of sessions so they could unpack all the reasons why they were sick. Again the fear of the trauma. All of the trauma.

ROY: Yeah. Yeah. Of course.

JACK: All the things that happen to people when they are broken.

ROY: Right.

JACK: And sometimes physical diseases are caused by that inner turmoil. And they know that biologically. They know that when you have strongholds in your mind when you’re believing lies about yourself those lies literally have a stronghold on a human being and it creates a chemistry that’s very foul inside of the body and creates disease!

ROY: Let me just say this. That there’s nobody better that can take me through something than somebody that’s already gone through it themselves! 

JACK: Uh-huh.

ROY: And I think that’s what God has done with you in this healing center! I wanna hear more about this.

JACK: Sure!

ROY: And I’m really happy and inspired by your testimony because I don’t necessarily trust people unless they have a limp!

JACK: Yeah!

ROY: Unless they have been through something they can say look, I’ve experienced that! It’s one of the things I love about Jesus the most because He stood where we’re standing. 

JACK: Uh-huh.

ROY: He walked where we’re walking today! And I wanna get into that [music] in just a moment! We’re gonna come back with my guest Jack Sheffield and we’ll be right back with Something More!
[music]
Announcer
[music]

ROY: Well hello! Welcome back to Something More! I’m Roy Fields and my guest is Jack Sheffield and we’ve been talking about his healing ministry and we did a little background and found out where he came from. He came out of a very dark place and then he gave his life to Christ! And I love how you said it, Jack! You said like liquid honey the Lord instantly saved me and then I was filled with the Holy Spirit with tongues and then instantly He gave me a healing ministry!

JACK: Uh-huh.

ROY: You know some people they get saved and then they progress and then they - it takes them years sometimes to get to that place where they’re called.

JACK: Uh-huh.

ROY: It happened in an instant with you!

JACK: Yes.

ROY: Do you feel it’s because you’re kind of like a rebellious Paul kind of thing in the making or I should say a rebellious Saul becoming the Paul in the making.
JF: Uh-huh, uh-huh.

ROY: Would that be fair to categorize that a little bit?

JACK:  I think so.

ROY: Okay.

JACK: Exactly. Yeah.

ROY: Well you talked about when we came out of the segment we talked about your healing center in San Antonio.  

JACK: Yes. Christ Healing Center.

ROY: Christ Healing Center. Go back and tell me why you guys have that place. What’s happening?

JACK: Sure.

ROY: Cause you go to hospitals and you travel all over the place!

JACK: We do! We have ministered to over 20,000 people.

ROY: Wow!

JACK: And these are in extended appointments.

ROY: Yeah.
JF: Where people can unpack the reason why they’re sick. The reason why they’re in such darkness. And we’ve seen everything from paranoid schizophrenia to chronic brain diseases healed. Cancers, you know all -

ROY: So you deal with terminally ill as well?

JACK: Exactly.

ROY: Yeah.

JACK: And we watch God turn everything around! It’s amazing! But the thing about it is we realized that only so many people could come into our healing center.

ROY: Uhh!

JACK: And so a couple of years ago we actually heard the Lord say I want you to get outside of these four walls! My people are hurting in the marketplace!

ROY: Uh-huh.
JF: And so I found out about several healing centers. There’s only two that I know of in the chapels of hospitals. Have you ever seen anybody in a chapel of a hospital? They’re usually empty.

ROY: It’s usually empty!

JACK: Yeah!

ROY: That’s true. Yeah.

JACK: Well we found out that you could put a prayer team inside of a chapel and open up heaven over hospitals!

ROY: That’s awesome!

JACK: And God had those angels go up and down and start to see miracles and signs and wonders inside of the hospital. I’m talking about major medical centers!

ROY: Wow!
JF: And God has given us, favor to do that! He’s given us a covenant with nine hospitals in a large Methodist hospital system and our first prototype has been extraordinarily successful!

ROY: And you’re having many people go through the program and you’re having some amazing results from what you were telling me?

JACK: We are!

ROY: You got any highlights like somebody that really got - like something that sticks out in your forefront?

JACK: Exactly. You know it took about 6 or 7 months for us to really break through into the atmosphere in that hospital?

ROY: Uh-huh.

JACK: We did a lot of intercessory, prayer. There weren’t a lot of people coming in and that kind of thing. And then staff started coming in! Of all people!

ROY: Hmm!
JF: Staffers! They’re stressed out! They’re - you know burn out is a reality. And we have this amazing chaplain who wants us to succeed more than she wants for herself! 

ROY: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah!

JACK: And so this hospital started going through a transformation and when people walk in there they feel the joy! They feel the amazement of the Spirit of God and an open heaven! And they’re a four-star hospital now!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: I mean they are excelling in every area! The CEO comes in for prayer on a consistent basis!

ROY: Oh that’s awesome! It’s awesome to see that!

JACK: It’s the most wonderful marriage you can possibly imagine!

ROY: Yeah!

JACK: But I think the greatest thing that has happened is there was a family that came into the chapel and they were gonna have to pull the plug on their dad. And they came into the chapel. They were disheveled. They were confused. They were grieving. Several were angry. They didn’t wanna do it! They came into the chapel to find some kind of resolution and how to get you know a single mind about how to do this. They didn’t want any prayer from us. They didn’t want us to touch them or anything! So our team just backed off and just started releasing heaven right over the top of that family!

ROY: So is this just one hospital or are you starting to venture out to more hospitals?

JACK: We’re in 6 hospitals now!

ROY: Six!

JACK: Uh-huh. And about to go into our seventh in a few months!

ROY: Okay.

JACK: But this prototype was everything and what happened to this family was they were able to come to a resolve, they were able to come to peace! They thanked us for praying over them. They went upstairs. The chaplain was already up there with one of our team members who’s a retired physician and she said the prayer over this person. He had no viable functional heart. He had no viable kidneys whatsoever!   

ROY: Huh!

JACK: They knew it when they pulled the plug he was going to expire because there was nothing to keep him alive. And so when they pulled the plug he sat up and he said how youÆall doing!

ROY: Hah-hah!

JACK: And it just absolutely sent shockwaves through the team!

ROY: And God uses you in the joy area too, doesn’t he?

JACK: Absolutely! I mean -

ROY: You have some people like have some belly-laughing and -

JACK: Oh my God, yeah!

ROY: They get healed even in that, isn’t it?  

JACK: They do! There was a particular situation -

ROY: I like hearing that! That’s one of my favorites when people get healed by joy!

JACK: Yeah. You know I was asked by a pastor - we were in a conference together - and everything was going great, everything was funny as heck you know and you know it was just the glory of the Lord was in this place!

ROY: Yeah.

JACK: There was a woman that was up in the audience and the pastor came up to me and said I want you to go minister to that lady. She’s got 2 weeks to live! She was a bag of bones! She weighed about 80 pounds and she was very, very gaunt and drawn and despairing! In abject despair! So I went up to her and I’m thinking I have nothing! God, what have I got for this woman? I don’t have - if you don’t do something God there’s nothing gonna happen here!

ROY: Right. Right.

JACK: I don’t feel anything! God, what am I gonna do, you know? And I’m like okay, just go. I knelt down in front of her and I heard the Lord say “I laugh at cancer!” So I looked at her and I said you’re gonna laugh with me! And she’s going you’re crazy!

ROY: Right.

JACK: I’m dying! I’m dying! Don’t you understand? I’m dying! And I said no, you don’t understand! It says in Psalm 2 that God is enthroned in the heavens and He laughs His enemies into derision! You’re gonna laugh with me! And she goes you are absolutely crazy! I can’t laugh. Can’t you see? And I said come on! And I went huh!

ROY: [laughing]

JACK: And she said you are, absolutely - and I went on! Come on, huh! And she went huh. And I said come on. Huh - huh! And she went huh - huh. And then huh - huh - huh. And then huh - huh - huh. And then she fell out of her chair laughing!

ROY: No way!

JACK: Rolling on the ground laughing! Everybody that came within 5 feet of her fell on the ground laughing!

ROY: That’s awesome, man!

JACK: It was a glory zone of the joy unspeakable and full of glory! There is a joy that is unspeakable!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: And it was all over her and she laughed for probably 20 minutes on that floor!

ROY: Well the Bible clearly God says the joy of the Lord is our strength!

JACK: Yes!

ROY: And it’s not just a cliche, it’s actually, power in those words!

JACK: It is power! Yes!

ROY: And joy comes from the inside out, doesn’t it?

JACK: That’s it. It does!

ROY: It comes from our belly!

JACK: It does!

ROY: You know I wanna - there’s two things I wanna talk to you about then we’re gonna pray with you that are watching today or tonight, whenever you’re watching this program! You told me that God is using you with “lightning anointing!”

JACK: Yes.

ROY: And then you told me something about that the Lord said He is your buckler?

JACK: Yes!

ROY: We’re gonna come back with that in just a moment. [music] We’re here with Jack Sheffield and you’re watching Something More! I’m Roy Fields! We’ll be right back right after this!
[music]
announcer
[music]

ROY: Well hello! [music ends] I’m Roy Fields and you’re watching Something More. My guest today is Jack Sheffield and I wanna get back into that story, man! You’re talking about this lady who is dying!

JACK: Yes.

ROY: Terminal cancer and you say “huh!”  

JACK: [laughs]

ROY: [laughs] And she starts to laugh!

JACK: We primed the pump!

ROY: What happened?

JACK: We primed the pump!

ROY: Well tell me! Finish that story!
JF: The next day she walked into the kitchen area and into the dining room so we could have breakfast. And she was walking erect! She was walking - she was not humped over! She wasn’t crawling you know in her spirit. She was erect! She was stalwart! 

ROY: And in the natural, she’s just a thin, little small bag of bones as you said.

JACK: Yeah. The next morning we finished up our conference when she walked into the breakfast area again she had supernaturally gained 10 pounds! Her face was full! She was not gaunt. She looked healthy!

ROY: Really!
JF: She looked - her skin was not gray.

ROY: That’s a-maze-ing!

JACK: She was absolutely transformed! When I got home a couple of weeks later the pastor called me up and said they did all of these tests on her. They cannot find cancer anywhere!

ROY: WOW!

JACK: Laughter doeth good like a medicine!

ROY: Come on!
JF: There is a laughter that’s full of glory!

ROY: That’s awesome!

JACK: And laughter in that regard is really warfare!

ROY: Yeah!

JACK: It’s a power! You talk about strength! It’s a power!

ROY: I think it drives the devil nuts!

JACK: Absolutely!

ROY: He does not wanna see people happy.
JF: Absolutely!

ROY: And joyful!

JACK: Yeah!

ROY: Cause his life isn’t joyful!

JACK: That’s right.

ROY: So why should they be. That’s beautiful! Well, I wanna get into this. You shared with me before - I was talking with Jack just before we did this program and you were talking about the Lord has given you a “lightning anointing” that fries the devil!

JACK: Yes!

ROY: I wanna - that should be like a book!
JF: Yeah. [laughs]

ROY: Lightning that fries the devil!

JACK: Yeah!

ROY: You can trademark that. I can help you out. No, I’m just kidding. Tell me about! What is that?

JACK: Very early on in my ministry, we were doing a sign-in. In East Texas you do sing-ins and people come from miles around! You just sing all day long! A gentleman I came in and sat down beside him and he was dying of heart disease. He had an enlarged heart. And when I sat down beside him a lightning bolt from heaven shot down and hit him and me! Blasted both of us and was both just sittinÆ there like this because of this electric shock that came out of heaven! 

ROY: All right. Now help me out! Was this in the natural?

JACK: No.

ROY: Was this in the spirit?
JF: No, this is physical.

ROY: Physical?

JACK: This is physical.

ROY: You’re talking about a physical lightning bolt -

JACK: Lightning bolt, yes!

ROY: Came out of the sky?

JACK: Yes! And the Bible talks about, the Lightning.

ROY: You were outside? Indoors?

JACK: The Lightning's of God, are very, very real!

ROY: Sure.

JACK: It talks about them over and over again!

ROY: But were you outside or indoors?

JACK: We were indoors.

ROY: And a lightning bolt came through the building?
JF: Right! Right!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: The songs, the worship it was glorious and I believe there was an open heaven and whatever’s, at the throne - you know in an open heaven. Whatever’s in-the-throne, is available to us here, in, this earth! Lightning's are going on around that throne all the time. Shot down. He was completely instantly healed of an enlarged heart!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: The man lived for another 12 years after that!

ROY: No kidding!

JACK: Yes.

ROY: And you also said to me you said that the Lord said to you that He is your buckler!

JACK: Yes!

ROY: You were really emphatic when you said that so what is that?

JACK: I want you to hear how it happened to me! 

ROY: Tell me!
JF: I went to seminary and about died! I just - I about died! You know about died of intellectualism!

ROY: Some people say cemetery but you said sem-inter-y?

JACK: Yeah.

ROY: What’d you say?

JACK: Seminary.

ROY: Seminary.

JACK: Yes.

ROY: Okay. Got it!

JACK: And I fell asleep in one of my own sermons one night!

ROY: [laughs]

JACK: It was, seriously; it was that bad!

ROY: [laughs] You brought your own pillow!

JACK: Oh my God! [laughs]

ROY: [laughs]

JACK: And so I wanted to quit! All the power was gone! The anointing had left and everything! And so I was gonna get in the car and go home to my wife and to my two boys and I was gonna tell her honey, I quit! I can’t do this anymore! People are going to sleep during my sermons! You know I asked them not to do that and they started wearing sunglasses to church. You know that’s just not right!

ROY: Right.

JACK: You know so I wouldn’t see them sleeping.

ROY: I understand.

JACK: Well anyway so I get in my car and all my radio programs - you know this is a push button radio - all my radio programs were Christian. Okay? And so I’m gonna drive home and tell my wife I quit. And I’m so depressed and I turn on one of the radio stations and it was all the way from Corpus Christi. I’m in Dallas. You don’t get Corpus Christi! Okay?

ROY: Right.

JACK: This is a supernatural event!

ROY: Okay.

JACK: And she’s going THE BIBLE SAYS! And I said I can’t listen to that! I said I’m an intellectual! I know Greek. I know Hebrew! I can’t listen to that so I started to touch the dial and she goes DON'T TOUCH THAT DIAL! [thumps desk] And I jump back!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: Almost jumped out of my window! [laughs] She said I know what you’re going through! I understand what’s happening to you! You wanna quit, don’t you? And I looked at that radio and she said you’re dog-depressed and you just wanna give up, don’t you? And I said yes, maÆam. Roy, I’m in such bad shape I’m talking to a radio here and a radio is talking to me! 

ROY: Yeah. Right.

JACK: And she said there’s only one thing that you need to do! And then the radio goes [makes radio static sound] you know cause it was from Corpus Christi.

ROY: Right.

JACK: And I said no, no, no! And she said, “let me say it again!” [laughs]

ROY: Where’s the. buckler part?

JACK: She said, "return to me, says the Lord, and I will return to you!" And I wept 90 miles all the way to Tyler, Texas!

ROY: Wow!

JACK: My point is is that when I couldn’t get out of this mess; God as your buckler, will hold you when you’re in your mess!

ROY: Mmm!

JACK: The buckler -

ROY: He steps in.

JACK: Well He’s holding you. He’s got a hold of you! That’s that buckler on that shield and when the devil hits you so hard he tries to dislodge that shield from you, your protection, God says I’ve got you! Somebody said it this way. You don’t need to hold on to this faith, this faith will hold on to you!

ROY: There’s somebody watching right now that they need to hear that! Can you just talk to somebody that feels like God doesn’t have a hold of them?

JACK: Sure.

ROY: Maybe just reinsure them, assure them.

JACK: Absolutely! There are so many of you out there that are in that place where you wanna give up. Right now you’re even thinking about suicide. Suicide is becoming rampant in our culture! There is, such depression and such darkness that’s entered into people’s minds! There’s such fear. And I want you to know that you are not alone! There’s somebody’s that’s got you! He’s not only your shield but He’s your buckler! He’s got a hold of you and He’s not gonna let go! Just like He wouldn’t let go of me! Just like He wouldn’t let me quit He’s not gonna let you! And He’s gonna come down and He’s gonna touch you right this very moment! And I pray for a lightning from heaven to come down and fry that destruction that’s inside of you! FRY that depression! FRY that willingness to give up and just absolutely annihilate the design and the strategy of the enemy to destroy you! And I declare right now that you’re gonna return to Him and He’s gonna return to you! He’s saying to you I miss you! I miss you! You used to spend time with me! You used to love-on-me! You used to worship me and you used to spend all that time with Me! I want you to come back to Me now and as you do I promise you I will more than come and overflow you with the goodness and the mercy of my heart! And I will restore all that the enemy has stolen from you! In “Jesus’ name! Depression you are CRUSHED in the name of Jesus Christ right now! Amen!

ROY: In “Jesus’ name!

JACK: Amen.

ROY: Awesome! Man, if you watched that right now and you are blessed by what you’ve heard and you feel something happening you need to get a hold of the program. You can look on whatever web site you’re watching right now but get a hold of them and tell them man, that just touched me! They wanna hear that! Jack, it’s been tremendous getting to know you, your story! I pray God uses your healing center all over Texas even in more hospitals!

JACK: Thank you, Roy!

ROY: I feel like 6 is not enough! I think there’s gonna to be, many, many, more, that will come into your track!

JACK: Thank you!

ROY: And you’re just a blessing, man! Thanks for sharing your story today!

JACK: You’re the one that’s a blessing, Roy! Thank you so much!

ROY: I appreciate it, man! Well, I’m Roy Fields! [music] You’re watching Something More and this has been my guest Jack Sheffield

ROY: [laughing] And we really appreciated having him on the program! Keep watching! We’ll see you next time! God bless you! Bye, bye!

This Conversation is from Sid Roth's Show It's Supernatural. To watch more visit Sid Roth.

Comments

Popular posts from this blog

Sid Roth Interview Session With his guest Laurie

Sid Roth Interview Session With Jonathan Bernis

Sid Roth Interview Session with his Guest David-Piper